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The Fiat G-91 evaluated by USAAF


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#11 Stony

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 06:55 PM



It was a Dassault/Dornier cooperation.

Edited by Stony, 01 February 2017 - 06:57 PM.

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#12 Armand

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 08:43 PM

It was a Dassault/Dornier cooperation.


I know (now. As such surprising statements usally wont be un-checked by Me!).
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#13 Kutscha

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Posted 01 February 2017 - 10:22 PM

The Jaguar actually came to My mind in the car this morning :-o I comfort myself with Stony's confirmation of Yet another troublesome cooperation ;-)
BTW: What became AMX-30 and Leopard-1 started likely as a French/German cooperation of developing a new generation of battle-tanks!


I had no idea of the Alpha Jet being a joint venture :-(

 

France was very interested in the design as its own AMX 50 project had just failed. In June 1957, West Germany and the French Fourth Republic signed an agreement to develop a common tank, designated in German Europa-Panzer. Three German (Arbeitsgruppe A, B and C) and one French design team would be included in a competition, with each team producing two prototypes. In September 1958, Italy joined the development program. Several prototypes were entered for testing in 1960. Among the prototypes were Porsche's Model 734 from team A, sporting a cast turret, and that of team B (Rheinmetall), whose cast turret was somewhat higher. Team C from Borgward, designing a very futuristic tank, failed to have a prototype ready in time.

 

Wiki



#14 GregP

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Posted 03 February 2017 - 11:58 PM

Seems like most of the "joint ventures" fail to materialize and either wind up not getting built or just fading away, as you guys have pointed out. Wonder why?

 

Breguet even built a jet called the Taon (an anagram of NATO), and set two world speed records with it ... and it faded away, too. Then again, so did Breguet ... or, rather, it merged with Dassault.



#15 Armand

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Posted 04 February 2017 - 12:20 AM

Seems like most of the "joint ventures" fail to materialize and either wind up not getting built or just fading away, as you guys have pointed out. Wonder why?

Breguet even built a jet called the Taon (an anagram of NATO), and set two world speed records with it ... and it faded away, too. Then again, so did Breguet ... or, rather, it merged with Dassault.

I guess the French contains a great deal of nationalistic arrogance :-/
The Talon, however, is just another forgotten contender of a design contest. The counterparts in the contest wich the Fiat G-91 won have likely been forgotten for decades!

Edited by Armand, 04 February 2017 - 12:21 AM.


#16 Kutscha

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Posted 04 February 2017 - 01:05 AM

No 'l' in the word Armand. https://en.wikipedia...et_Br.1001_Taon

 

Looks something a Folland Gnat.

kl%2004-2013%20Breguet%20Taon%20(01).jpg

 

Not all Armand as the Northrop design had over 2000 built. I did R&O on the inertial navigation system.



#17 Armand

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Posted 04 February 2017 - 12:59 PM

No 'l' in the word Armand.

Argh - Tell My spell-control :-(

Looks something a Folland Gnat.

Yes, and no! IMO have the Gnat somewhat more organic lines where the Taon looks more toy-ish!

Not all Armand as the Northrop design had over 2000 built. I did R&O on the inertial navigation system.

I have only become aware of the competitors to the Fiat now, and the Taon was actually among them!
The following succes of the F-5 only underlines the earlier statement of the individual Nations decide of own wish in the end.

Edited by Armand, 04 February 2017 - 01:00 PM.


#18 GregP

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Posted 05 February 2017 - 08:33 PM

Well, the Italians and Japanese built several US designs but, overall, the joint ventures don't seem to have made much of a mark. The Japanese-US cooperation was probably among the best. They built F-86s and several designs going forward, and even came up with their own F-16 variant, the Mitsubishi F-2. Their F-1 looks like a Jaguar.

 

The Italian F-104s soldiered on for some time, and the Italian aircraft industry seems to have concentrated in the light attack area, largely. 



#19 Stony

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Posted 05 February 2017 - 09:00 PM

Well, the Italians and Japanese built several US designs but, overall, the joint ventures don't seem to have made much of a mark. The Japanese-US cooperation was probably among the best. They built F-86s and several designs going forward, and even came up with their own F-16 variant, the Mitsubishi F-2. Their F-1 looks like a Jaguar.

The Italian F-104s soldiered on for some time, and the Italian aircraft industry seems to have concentrated in the light attack area, largely.


The Japanese also buildt their own version of the F-4, P-3 and F-104 and probably I am forgetting some types...

The Italians have had a cooperation with Brasil wich resulted in the not very succesfull AMX.
On the other hand the Italians play a big part in production of the Eurofighter and have merged their helicopter industry with the Brits succesfully.

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